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Steering differences
http://international2cvfriends.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=7&t=931		 Page 1 of 3
Author:  EirikJ [ October 13th, 2009, 10:35 pm ]
Post subject:  Steering differences
Here's something that puzzles my mind:

Two 2CV's. Same models. They have the same type of steeringrack. Same type of steeringwheel. Both cars are in very good condition with new frames, steeringparts and repaired body's. One have 125x15 Michelin X and the other 135x15 modern wintertires. Airpressure checked. There are no problems with the ignitionlock-parts(clamp on steeringtube) on any of them. The endpieces on the steering is correcly adjusted as described in the repear manual. No bad noises or any thing that can indicate something is wrong. Both feels nice to drive. Toe in/out is only checked on one of them.

But, one car is significantly easier than the other, on the steeringwheel when turning.

Any ideas why :?:
Author:  Russell [ October 13th, 2009, 10:40 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Steering differences
Seized kingpin maybe? A car I drove last weekend had the same problem, very heavy steering, which became much easier when the kingpins were greased and worked back and forth through their full arc.


I might be wrong, but it seemed to do the trick on that car..
Author:  EirikJ [ October 13th, 2009, 11:13 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Steering differences
Nope, it's not the kingpins. They have been replaced not long ago and that did not change the feel of the steering. It is not very heavy. I have been driving that car for a long time and thought it was supposed to be like that. But this other car has lighter steering. And I cant think of why....

Can it be a good idea to check the steering column alignment?
Author:  2CViking [ October 13th, 2009, 11:20 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Steering differences
Track rod end housing pushing on the steering arm ball joint.

Did you replace one steering pinion. The reproduction one is too long and needs shortening

Attachment:
1300112.jpg
Author:  Russell [ October 13th, 2009, 11:24 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Steering differences
2CViking wrote:
Track rod end housing pushing on the steering arm ball joint.


yes, I should have thought of that!
Author:  ken [ October 13th, 2009, 11:27 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Steering differences
Eirik,
have you tried jacking the front of each car off the ground, then turning the steering from lock to lock by holding the road wheels?
Because this bypasses the 'gearing' of the rack, it makes comparison of the effort required to move the steering easier.
You could even attach a spring balance to one of the road wheels... ;)

Btw, are the track rod ends correctly centred in their housings?
If they aren't, this can affect the freedom of movement of the steering.

ken.

Hehe, Viking got there first, while I was rambling on... ;)
Author:  Xmas [ October 14th, 2009, 12:37 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Steering differences
Maybe a daft suggestion, but are they the same ride height? The lower the car the heavier the steering (unless you get custom front arms made for going really low).

Also the 135 Winter Tyres (Michelin M&S?) would put a fair bit more footprint on the ground than the wee 125 Mich Xs - you could swap them over and see if the steering feels the same or different on each car.
Author:  EirikJ [ October 14th, 2009, 2:24 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Steering differences
Quote:
Track rod end housing pushing on the steering arm ball joint.

Nope. Did my homework and it's all done by the book. Centered and all. But I might loosen the end-nut a bit more?

Quote:
Did you replace one steering pinion

No.

Quote:
have you tried jacking the front of each car off the ground, then turning the steering from lock to lock by holding the road wheels?

I have tried on the car with the heavier steering. It seem ok to me. Easy to turn the steering by pulling the roadwheels....

Quote:
are they the same ride height? The lower the car the heavier the steering

True true. But both cars have the same ridehight. Standard hight.

Quote:
Also the 135 Winter Tyres (Michelin M&S?) would put a fair bit more footprint on the ground than the wee 125 Mich Xs

Yes, I will imagine so, but it is the car with the lightest steering who have these tires.......

I really dont get this difference :roll:
The car with the heaviest steering is the one I've had the longest. I have changed lots of parts, for other reasons, and the steering has always felt the same. I drove another 2CV once and it felt the same as the one I have with the "heavy" steering. It dont bother me much, I haven't even thought about it, before I got this other car and drove it for a couple of days. Then I started wondering why this new car had such a "easy going" steering...

I'll try to have a look at it during this week.... I'll come back to it if I find something!

Thanks a lot for the suggestions though! And keep them coming ;)
Author:  toomany2cvs [ October 14th, 2009, 11:16 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Steering differences
EirikJ wrote:
Quote:
Also the 135 Winter Tyres (Michelin M&S?) would put a fair bit more footprint on the ground than the wee 125 Mich Xs

Yes, I will imagine so, but it is the car with the lightest steering who have these tires.......


It's so quick and easy to test and rule the tyres out that it seems rude not to.

Might also be worth lifting the floor mat, pulling the rubber bung out of the hole around the steering column, and making sure both are going through the centre of the hole in the bulkhead - also remove the steel cover plate at the back of the ignition lock and make sure the lock collar bolts are accessible through the "window" in the lock housing. It might well be that either chassis or body is sagging...
Author:  Jonathan [ October 14th, 2009, 2:54 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Steering differences
Forgive me if this has been mentioned, I've not read all the posts, but.....

The steering rack was altered c1976, to reduce effort, it may be that the 'heavier' car has a replacement rack, off an older car(second-hand/refurbished)? Just a thought.
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